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| Re: Don't pay 1% commission if you find the flat yourself |
 02 May 08 5:21 pm |
| buyers unite wrote: | There is a court case coming up. A property agent company is suing a couple for refusing to pay the 1% buyer commission.
I'm a buyer looking for a HDB flat. When I see an ad and go to view a flat, agents tell me I have to pay 1% commission to buy. I don't see why I have to because the seller agent is already collecting 2% from the owner. Fair enough, the agent has to advertise, show the flat etc -- but if he doesn't do this, how is he going to sell the flat?
But what service is the seller agent giving to the buyer? None! The buyer has to look through many ads, pick up the phone and do the calling, ask questions, make the appointment, go there himself.
And if nobody calls up to view the flat, how will the agent sell the flat? Unless he is already acting for some other clients who are looking for that flat.
Seller agents don't even answer questions about the flat directly e.g.
"Is this a lift-level flat?"
"Low floor."
"So which floor?"
"Below 6th floor."
"But WHICH floor? 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 5th also below 6th!"
"Er, 2nd floor."
Seller agents think that by doing this they can trick buyers to view the flat so they can boast to the owner or their colleagues about the many people who came. Timing all the viewings at the same time also gives the impression that it's a hot property so they can pressure buyers to sign immediately.
It's different if I engage an agent who knows what I want and finds me some flats to view, then makes the appointments for me. If the flats are not suitable, he looks again... To this agent I'll pay a commission if I buy a flat found by him. But if I find a flat by myself, I won't pay him anything.
Seller agents will tell you that it is "normal" or "the usual practice" to pay this 1% commission to them. Often, buyers pay up because they are told only just before the sale contract is signed and they really want the flat. But is this 1% commission legal, set down as law? The authorities have been vague about this.
There is a conflict of interest if an agent gets commission from both seller and buyer. Whose side is he on? Of course the one who pays more! As buyers we need to stop this bullying by the seller agents.
Buyers: As the court case is coming up, this is a good time to speak up against this unfair 'practice'. WRITE TO ALL THE NEWSPAPERS, CALL THE RADIO STATIONS, CALL THE HOTLINES, SPEAK TO YOUR MPs TO PROTEST THIS WIDESPREAD UNFAIR COMMISSION. THEN SOMEONE UP THERE WILL HAVE TO MAKE A COMMENT TO MAKE THINGS CLEAR.
Meanwhile, refuse to pay 1% commission if you find the flat yourself! If enough buyers refuse, the seller agents will have to give in. Unless they can find other desperate buyers. The Singapore economy is heading for bad times, so buyers' market, ok?! |
i totally agree!!
Since I'm the one doing the calling why should i pay! |
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| Re: Don't pay 1% commission if you find the flat yourself |
02 May 08 5:29 pm |
| If buyer dont want to pay the 1 percent com, just highlight to the seller agent before viewing. No point argue after you viewed the house and you like the house, willing to pay the selling price but in the end dont pay the 1 percent com. |
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TGIF
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02 May 08 5:39 pm |
I AGREE with "Buyers Unite"
What value add and service has the seller's agent done to help the buyers? = NONE!
And some of them are rude & unhelpful when they answer us...
I also have to look thru newspaper & website everyday to find my own flat... If I'm required to pay a $500 admin fee for the transaction I still don't mind... but paying 1% is really too much for that little that they do...
In fact, with websites like this... No matter we are buyers or sellers, we don't really need the agents... so they better wake up & either value-add more or reduce their comm charges or end up with no business... |
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02 May 08 5:47 pm |
| Yes buyer should only pay a small fee(500$) for the paperwork that seller's agent will do. Apart from that he doesnt deserve anything. |
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02 May 08 8:28 pm |
What paperwork? You can fill in the OTP (Option to Purchase) form yourself for the buyer part. The seller should fill in his part himself -- or ask his agent to if he has one.
The forms may come in multiple copies but they are only copies i.e. you fill in the same info more than once. If you can read, you should be able to fill in the forms yourself. Otherwise, ask HDB if you have the time. $500 for forms which the seller agent have to fill up for his own client? Easy money leh! |
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02 May 08 8:36 pm |
| I totally agree with buyer's unite, though im not intending to buy any flats atm. Where do i find the court case?? Just curious... |
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02 May 08 11:01 pm |
DON'T BUY HOUSE THRU THE AGENT LOH>>>>
IF NOT, JUST PAY THE COMMISSION>>>
WHY WANT TO COMPLAINT SO MUCH>> |
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03 May 08 1:02 am |
Think about the tips you pay in most restaurants..10% service charge, 1% cess charge...do you complaint likewise???
You came upon the restaurant , probably through words of mouth, from advertisements on paper, flyers, radio broadcasting and you taste it...find it so..so, not bad, good..etc, in the end after the food, you still gotta pay for the foods inclusive of the 10% service and 1%cess and GST...any complaints? I mean generally speaking...?
Similarly for property agents, you came upon their ads and after successfully gotten the unit, they do all the paperworks, legworks, etc, and they charge 1%.....well , I admit thats probably 1K to 6K for a typical 2rm to Executive HDB agent's fee but hey, isnt it the same scenario as above?
As a property agent, in my humble opinion, in this case, seller's agent attending to buyer is entasked to be professional, dedicated and humble but 100% commitment to the buyer. Even if the buyers came upon the ads themselves, with the satisfaction or even better kinda service render to them, at the end of the day, I feel its worthwhile afterall. Anyway, how often an average person buy/sell a property here?
My 2 cents and no defamation or whatsoever, peace to all.
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03 May 08 1:11 am |
No problem, can dont pay these agents their commisions.
So agents if any of the buyers do not want to pay you,
just do your normal duty (act for the sellers only).
Let them sign the OTP, let them pay the amt of deposit owner request (usually $1K, although min is $1, owner will of course wants the max right).
Let them find and apply for their loans and lawyers themselves,
if anything doesn't goes smoothly within 14 days, their deposit gone right?
Who is to be blame then? |
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03 May 08 2:06 am |
If agents are so efficient and professional, how come there're buyers who ended up losers because they had been 'misinformed' about their eligibility for loans, grants etc or because their agents 'forgot' to hand in OTP, loan applications, loan approvals etc?
If your logic goes, then when we go to the supermarket and buy something from one of those auntie demonstrators who earn commission for each item they sell, we must also pay them a commission on top of the item price.
Pleeeeze.  |
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03 May 08 2:15 am |
| Anonymous wrote: | No problem, can dont pay these agents their commisions.
So agents if any of the buyers do not want to pay you,
just do your normal duty (act for the sellers only).
Let them sign the OTP, let them pay the amt of deposit owner request (usually $1K, although min is $1, owner will of course wants the max right).
Let them find and apply for their loans and lawyers themselves,
if anything doesn't goes smoothly within 14 days, their deposit gone right?
Who is to be blame then? |
That's right, that's just the kind of arrogance which turns off prospective buyers.
I've sold a flat myself, to my neighbour, and we did all the paper work ourselves. It also took us just 2 appointments with HDB. We were no Noble Prize geniuses and didn't take any professional property agent course.
So don't make it sound as if what you do is that difficult.
Buyers, ask HDB for related brochures. They come in English, Chinese, Malay and Tamil.
HDB can also be your lawyer. |
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03 May 08 6:26 am |
| Anonymous wrote: | | Anonymous wrote: | No problem, can dont pay these agents their commisions.
So agents if any of the buyers do not want to pay you,
just do your normal duty (act for the sellers only).
Let them sign the OTP, let them pay the amt of deposit owner request (usually $1K, although min is $1, owner will of course wants the max right).
Let them find and apply for their loans and lawyers themselves,
if anything doesn't goes smoothly within 14 days, their deposit gone right?
Who is to be blame then? |
That's right, that's just the kind of arrogance which turns off prospective buyers.
I've sold a flat myself, to my neighbour, and we did all the paper work ourselves. It also took us just 2 appointments with HDB. We were no Noble Prize geniuses and didn't take any professional property agent course.
So don't make it sound as if what you do is that difficult.
Buyers, ask HDB for related brochures. They come in English, Chinese, Malay and Tamil.
HDB can also be your lawyer. |
i totally agree,its not as difficult as it may seem...hdb website is friendly and u can always call hdb hotline and they will guide u...its their job...and u can even attend their course...i think only half day and costs abt $25 and they will give u all the forms on the session...can ask the instructor there and then if u don understand.
i sold the flat myself and i made it clear i wont pay any commission to the buyers' agent b4 they view my flat...they had to agree as at least they could earn some commission from their buyers...
end of the day, i did not pay a single cent to the agent and save 3 over k...
now that i am looking for a flat myself...i will make it clear to seller's agent that i am unwilling to pay the agent's fee...and if they unhappy...i don view the flat lor....i am not in hurry to buy a flat anyway.... |
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03 May 08 9:17 am |
No money to pay agent commission then don't buy...look for other house in the market .......simple as that .... why complaining?????
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03 May 08 9:51 am |
| Hey arrogant agent!! It is not we don't have the money. The amount of work that you do does not command that amount of money. Just simple paper works and taking queue numbers by queue numbers at HDB Hub making people wait even when your client has not arrived making others wait and wait. Even my young childrens can do that. |
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03 May 08 9:57 am |
Let us first define the "agency" under singapore agency law.
"The relationship which arises where one person known as the agent acts for another known as the principal"
question - When is this relationship created
"The most obvious way to create an agency relationship is by express consent or authorization"
Or
"Another way in which an agency relationship can be created is where the authority is implied (by conduct/action/ for whom to carry out his duty within his job scope)
Case One : Buyer requests Seller's agent to act on his behalf to seal the deal by written consent or by mouth of words. Hence, a agency relationship is created.
Case Two : Buyer wants to buy the house without Seller's agent,
(i) allow the Seller's agent to do the paperworks for Buye, or
(ii) Buyer does all the paperworks himself
in (i) perhaps, the Buyer has given his authority to engage the Seller's agent by conduct (implied authorisation) hence a agency is created.
in (ii) No expressed/implied authorisation is given to Seller's agent. Therefore, no agency service is taken except for the Seller's share. Buyer, hence, does not has to pay agency commission fee.
Just my two cents comment |
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03 May 08 10:07 am |
| Anonymous wrote: | No money to pay agent commission then don't buy...look for other house in the market .......simple as that .... why complaining?????
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If buyers can afford to buy a house which costs few hundred thousand, you thought they cant afford to pay those arrogant agents? buyer are unwilling to pay because the lousy service provided, no value added and some even have attitude problem. |
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03 May 08 10:08 am |
HDB understands there are home buyers want to do DIY transaction for themselves as they can save a few thousand bucks.
On their website, helps are given to these people by uploading forms and self-help instructions.
So, why would buyers do the forms and attend all the troubles themselves and in the end they have to pay Seller's agent fee? Then why would HDB wants home seekers to go through all troubles and risks and yet allow agents to charge us fees provided intention is given in the first place not to use agent's service.
hmm.. |
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